In this episode, Jeff dives into the essential role of a Dental Treatment Coordinator, exploring the daily responsibilities and key tasks that keep a dental practice running smoothly. From managing patient schedules to explaining treatment plans and coordinating with insurance companies, the treatment coordinator plays a critical part in delivering a seamless patient experience.
Morning Production Meeting - https://mgeonline.com/morning-production-meeting-download
ABCs Seminar- https://www.mgeonline.com/mge-communication-and-sales-seminars/
DDS Success (coupon code MGE269) - https://ddssuccess.com/
The Importance of a New Patient Coordinator Tip- https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3T4Y7QKJfAk&t=
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Questions From This Episode
What is the purpose of a dental treatment coordinator?
The treatment coordinator's job is to help every patient with outstanding treatment understand, accept, pay for, and arrive for the care they need. Jeff describes it as a sales job, but one built on caring about the patient. Their statistic is practice income, because income comes from closing cases and getting patients into the chair.
What is a lineup, and why should you line up more than you need?
A lineup is a review of the coming week and each day to identify which scheduled patients have outstanding treatment and what closing those cases would be worth. Jeff recommends lining up more than your weekly goal, sometimes up to three times as much, because not everyone will close.
What are the nine basic duties of a treatment coordinator?
They are doing the lineup, meeting with patients for presentations and financial arrangements, following up on recent presentations, calling patients on the incomplete treatment list, getting overdue patients back on the hygiene schedule, bringing not-yet-due patients back for a quick doctor check, handling contracts and chart notes, and attending the morning production meeting and other coordination meetings.
How should a treatment coordinator work the incomplete treatment list?
Start with the larger, more urgent cases and check each chart. If the patient is due or overdue for hygiene, schedule them, because action happens when they are back in the practice. If they are not due, bring them in for a brief consultation with the doctor to confirm things are stable and present the plan again.
How do you know if you need more treatment coordinator hours?
If your treatment coordinator spends the whole day in patient meetings and has little or no time for follow-ups or the incomplete treatment list, you are missing opportunities. A part-time treatment coordinator or a new full-time hire the office manager apprentices may be the answer.
Episode Transcript
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What should the average dental treatment coordinator's day look like? Or even better, when a treatment coordinator isn't working with a patient during a consultation or making financial arrangements, what should they be working on? I get this question frequently from our clients during seminars, or from the treatment coordinators they've brought with them. When I'm not with the doctor doing a presentation, where should I be placing my focus?
To understand that, and to make sure your treatment coordinator has the best shot at being successful, it takes a basic understanding of the position itself and its purpose. Then it's easy to understand what the average treatment coordinator's day should look like. That's what I want to talk about in this week's episode: the treatment coordinator's day-to-day duties and functions. My name is Jeff Blumberg and I'm your host.
The best place to start is by taking a look at the position of treatment coordinator and comparing it to other businesses, to figure out what the corresponding position would be in another service business. The answer is very simple. It's a sales job. The job of the treatment coordinator is to sell.
If you take another business that sells some type of service, whether it's roofing or car repairs (and I'm not trying to compare healthcare to these things), there is a function that has to be done. You need someone there. It might be an estimator who sells your roofing job. Someone has to figure out what the person needs, which in a dental practice is really up to the doctor. But then someone has to work out how much it costs, get them to close, get them to pay for it, and contract it. That's the job of the salesperson.
I know that when you mention sales in relation to healthcare, it's almost a taboo word, although it's not as bad as it used to be. You don't want to say sales because "we don't sell in healthcare." Well, sure you do. If I come to see you and I need six crowns, but I only want to do what insurance covers, I should be sold on why I need all six so that I do them. That's better not just for you, because you'll make more money, but for me from a health perspective.
Sales really isn't all about getting money. If what you're doing is beneficial, it's about helping a person obtain the service or product they actually need. You're not selling terrible things that are going to destroy the person. You're selling healthcare. You're selling the ability to be healthier and improve their quality of life. That's a good thing. So you're helping them get the help they need. How is that achieved? Education, communication, helping them overcome objections, and getting them to pay is part of the process.
I believe that's where most of the focus goes, because people get a bit crazy on the subject of money. You've probably seen this. You're talking to a patient and they seem completely fine, and then you begin discussing the fees associated with their treatment plan, and it's almost as if they've had a personality transplant. What happened to the sweet person who was sitting in front of me and is now looking at me with daggers in their eyes? People get emotional about money, and money is an important function of life, society, and business.
But you should look at the money part of case presentation and acceptance as just another step. The person has to pay so that you can adequately provide the service, pay your staff, and keep your practice going. Just like they have to schedule and show up to get the service, it's of equal importance in the process. Just like they have to show up for you to be able to diagnose them. It's just another step.
Sales gets boiled down to "it's all about the money," but that really isn't what it's about. Yes, you have to get the person to pay, but it's just as important to make sure they actually arrive and receive the service or product you sold them. Caring about your prospect is an important part of this. If I actually care about my prospect, or in this case your patient, then I'm not going to sell them something they don't need or that isn't going to help them.
Think about car sales, for example, the area of sales that tends to get a lot of pushback. We don't want to deal with a so-called car salesperson. But what if a car salesperson had you come in and asked what you were looking for and what needs the car had to fulfill? Maybe you have a large family and need a larger car so everybody fits. You want everybody to be safe, and it has to be durable. They found the exact model that fit your specifications. Sure, you have to pay for it, but they cared enough about you to make sure you got what you needed. So care is an important part of sales. It isn't just about getting the money.
On top of this, I've trained a lot of salespeople, and it's not just a matter of closing. Closing is one part of sales, and even presenting is just one part. You have to make sure there are people in front of you to close, and an adequate number of them, so that you're closing enough to support the business. If I'm a treatment coordinator and I'm supposed to collect $50,000 this week, then I have to make sure I'm presenting to enough patients, with an adequate amount of treatment, to meet my goal. Obviously I'm not going to create treatment out of thin air. They either need it or they don't. But part of the job is lining up an adequate number of presentations and then doing those presentations so we get the closes the business needs. We're also getting those closes because we're helping to restore patients' health.
With all of that in mind, the purpose of a treatment coordinator in a dental practice is that it's a sales job. It's to help all of the practice's patients who have outstanding treatment understand, accept, pay for, and arrive for their diagnosed or needed treatment. If I'm your treatment coordinator, I look at the entire patient base as a whole, and for everybody who has outstanding treatment, my job is to make sure they get into this practice and get that treatment taken care of.
Am I going to get everybody through all of their outstanding treatment? That's a tall order. It's a work in progress, but I'm always working toward that ideal. That's the reason I'm there. That's my function. That's why I exist: to make sure your whole patient base is coming in and getting the treatment they need.
The really cool part is that in a dental practice, if patients get all the outstanding treatment they need and we restore their health and function (and aesthetics, in cases where that's important to them), it improves their quality of life. In many cases it also helps improve their systemic health, and they'll live longer. I know you can't guarantee this, but there are plenty of studies linking oral health to systemic health. So this is an excellent outcome not just for the practice, but for the patients themselves.
Any treatment coordinator should think about this. If someone is giving you a hard time, remember that you are there to help. Unfortunately, not everybody appreciates it when you present a treatment plan, and someone may yell at you and say you're money-grubbing and just after the money. Two things to know. One, not everybody feels that way. Two, most people really appreciate that you're there and trying to help them.
Part of helping people, especially with dental situations, is that many of them develop because of procrastination. People aren't dealing with things when they should. So that's part of what you have to overcome as you move this person along to taking care of it. They've developed various types of dental disease in their mouth. They have a few teeth in trouble. They need a few root canals and some crowns. They didn't always need those. Had they been taken care of earlier, they wouldn't have turned into root canals; they would have just been crowned. Had they been taken care of earlier than that, they would have just been fillings. That unwillingness to move off the dime is part of what you're helping them confront so they can handle the treatment they need.
I say this because I've told clients before: if you're ever having a bad day and things just don't seem to be going right, the collections are terrible, and you can't figure out what you should be working on, focus back on why you're there. Just help some people. You're going to help these patients get back into ideal oral health, which positively affects their lives. Find someone to help and place your focus there. That will work you out of more jams than you can possibly imagine.
So if the treatment coordinator's job is to help your entire patient base understand, pay for, schedule, and arrive for their outstanding treatment, how would you put a statistic on this job? Since this is a sales job, the treatment coordinator's statistic is income, the practice's revenues. The overall collections for the practice are their statistic.
With this in mind, what would their average day look like? The first thing to know, again, is that their statistic is income. Where does income come from? In your case it comes from closing cases. You then have to deliver those cases, of course, but that's the doctor's side of this.
To begin, if I'm a treatment coordinator, I would start with a goal for the month, and then break it down by the week. If you work only from the month, staying on top of who you have to see and what you have to do becomes difficult. I would start with the week and monitor it day by day. Say our goal for the month is $200,000. That means I need to figure out how to collect $50,000 this week.
That's where I'd start. I would look at what the coming week looks like. Who's coming in, and who needs what? I've mentioned in prior episodes something called the morning production meeting, and I'll put a link to it on the episode webpage. It's a coordination meeting you hold in the morning with your key personnel to figure out which patients have outstanding treatment and who's going to help present it. This is a critical part of increasing your income and putting some control on it.
The treatment coordinator would be looking at who's coming in on these days, and they'd be looking at the hygiene and doctor schedules for any outstanding treatment. We call this lining up your week, or doing your lineup. "Here's Mr. Jones. He's coming in on Tuesday. He has four outstanding inlays. If I close that case, that's $4,800." So you line up where you're going to get that $50,000 from this week.
A little trick with lineups: if you want to do a lineup effectively, always line up more than you need, because not everybody is going to close. In some cases I recommend lining up three times what you need, and you'd be surprised how much treatment walks into your practice and just does not get done. If you don't believe me, look at your hygiene schedule. It's there.
Then, on a day-to-day basis, because schedules do change, I would make sure my lineup is intact. Unless you have a new patient from something like an implant funnel, it's very difficult to put a dollar amount on a new patient in your lineup, because you have no idea what this person needs. I may call in and say I cracked my tooth, and it's really just a tiny chip that needs a teeny little composite. Or I may have broken my tooth in half. Until you've seen me, you don't really know what I need.
From there, the treatment coordinator's duties consist of nine basic actions. The first is doing the lineup, for the week and the day.
The second is meeting with patients on an as-needed basis, depending on when a treatment presentation is happening. I should mention here that the way we teach our clients at MGE to sell, the doctor is responsible for the sales process. Obviously you wear several hats in your practice. If you own your practice, you have your owner hat, which is your executive hat, then your doctor hat, and then your sales hat. Every hat in an organization has a different expected outcome. The result you'd expect from an executive might be an expanding organization. The result you'd expect from a doctor is a properly done treatment, or a well patient. The result you'd expect from a salesperson is closing. So the sales team is the doctor and the treatment coordinator.
As I progress through the episode I'll give you a couple of variations on this, but generally speaking, the way we teach our clients to begin with is to present the treatment to the patient with the treatment coordinator there. Why? Because by sitting through the consultation, the treatment coordinator will know how you handled the various objections the patient may have had, and those objections may come up again. When you leave the operatory or the consult room and I leave with the patient to work out financial arrangements, they may bring up that same exact objection.
You told them they needed six crowns, and they agreed. They come back to my office and now they ask, "What's insurance going to cover? Just two. Let me just do the two." Maybe they said that to you during the presentation and I heard how you handled it. I can repeat the same thing and in many cases handle the objection just like you did.
So ideally the treatment coordinator is there with you for the entire presentation and then goes off to work out financial arrangements. I'm not going to get into the entire sales process, because I've detailed it in prior episodes. The doctor should discuss fees in the presentation, and how involved you want to get is up to you. I don't have the episode numbers in front of me, full disclosure, but there are several episodes I've done on treatment presentations where we discuss how far the doctor can go with the financial discussion, a little or a lot. At minimum, I would expect the doctor to mention the cost, and then they go off with the treatment coordinator to work out wrapping it up.
The treatment coordinator works with the scheduler to get the patient scheduled, and then it's important that the patient actually shows up to begin treatment. In many cases, especially if the patient is financing or prepaying, that's a liability to the practice until the patient shows up. Back to the purpose: this is all about getting patients the treatment they need. Great, I got paid, but now I want to make sure the patient actually got what they came here for, which was the treatment. The second the patient is sitting in your chair to start treatment, my job as the treatment coordinator with that patient is done, for now.
So it runs from when you diagnose, through the presentation, the understanding, the financial arrangements, the closing, the scheduling, and getting them to arrive. That's essentially my job as the treatment coordinator. So, back to these nine points. I have my lineup that I do on a weekly basis, and I have my meetings with patients, for example during consultations.
If I'm not meeting with patients, what am I working on? The third item is following up on recent presentations, the near-closes. Maybe just one little thing needs to be handled in order to close the case. The patient said they had to go home and talk to their spouse, and there was no way to get the spouse in, or the spouse didn't want to talk to the doctor. I would follow up to make sure that gets resolved. Or the patient was refinancing and had to wait until they were done in order to pay for their treatment plan. Those are the types of follow-ups I would work on first.
In many cases I'll have a patient who's starting to wobble. You presented the case as the doctor, I sat in with you, and we got it to the point where the patient wanted to do it, but then they hit the brakes because they had to speak to their spouse. Now they've gone home, talked to their spouse, and the spouse is tepid about it. Generally, I'm going to attempt to get the patient back into the practice. Nowadays there are things you can do virtually. We do a lot of consultations and practice analyses virtually, because many of our clients are all over the country. It's never going to be as good as in person. But you're a local business, so there's no reason you can't get the patient and their spouse to come back in and talk to the doctor again. These things are usually resolved best face to face as opposed to over the phone. So I'll call the patient, they've talked to their wife and didn't want to do it, and I'll try to schedule them to come back in with her to talk to the doctor. Those are the immediate follow-ups.
When I'm not doing immediate follow-ups and not doing treatment presentations with the doctor, what am I working on? At that point I am doing outflow, communicating to the patient base. Which portion of the patient base would you want me focused on? Keep in mind the purpose of my position: to get all of your patients with outstanding treatment to get that treatment done, to restore their oral health, function, and aesthetics, which contributes to better overall health, longevity, and so on. You'll want me focusing on patients who have outstanding treatment.
So say I have no one to see right now and no immediate follow-ups. Now I have the incomplete treatment list. It's great that software keeps track of these things, but the utility of this list has not been very good. I've seen people advise that when you have openings in the schedule, you should call your incomplete treatment list. Ask your front desk, your schedule coordinator, or any of the administrative staff whether they've ever called that list and how useful it was. I can tell you from seminar to seminar where I bring this up, it's not very useful. Why?
Because a patient on the incomplete treatment list isn't closed on doing the service. That's ultimately what it is. You presented a treatment plan to me and, for whatever reason, I elected not to do it right now. I didn't want the treatment enough to proceed, or my objections weren't addressed enough to proceed. Now you're going to call me and say, "Hey Jeff, are you ready to do that treatment now?" Nine times out of ten, maybe even 99 times out of 100, I'm going to say no. I'm still thinking about it, I don't have the time, I'm very busy, I can't afford it, or whatever objection. Once in a blue moon you'll hear, "That's funny, you called me today. I was just thinking about it. I would like to proceed." That's the unicorn. It does not happen very often.
What ends up happening is that the incomplete treatment list just gets bigger and bigger, and you see all these lost opportunities. Some doctors total their lists up, because the software will do it for you. "Wow, my incomplete treatment list is $2.8 million." I was talking to an office recently that was over $6 million. This is treatment you've diagnosed and have not done.
That incomplete treatment list should be the purview of the treatment coordinator. This is the person who works that list. How do they work it? I know I'm backtracking a bit, but say we've gone through my day. I don't have a patient to see right now, I've done my immediate follow-ups, and I've got my lineup. Then I take the incomplete treatment list out and start calling it. I might order it by bigger treatment plans. I'm not calling the patient who needs one occlusal composite right now. I'm starting with the bigger cases and probably the more urgent cases. I look at the patient's chart and determine: A, is this patient due for a hygiene appointment, or B, is this person not due?
Say this person is due or overdue for a hygiene appointment. Say they're way overdue, three or four years. I'm going to call that patient and schedule them for a hygiene appointment. You might say that's counterintuitive. Why would the treatment coordinator schedule a hygiene appointment? I have a schedule coordinator to do that. Well, I'm scheduling a patient with a large outstanding treatment plan for a hygiene appointment, and that makes sense because I'm getting them back into the practice. Action happens when we get them back in the practice. That's when they close, and that's where we're going to treat them and take care of their dental problems. Nothing is going to happen outside of the dental practice, so I want them back.
In those cases I might schedule a re-initial exam or something like that, and now we have that opportunity again. They're back in the practice. We get updated x-rays, charting, and scans, we can look at what's going on, adjust the treatment plan as needed, and present it then and there. That's what I'm doing with patients who are due or overdue for hygiene. I'm getting them back on the hygiene schedule.
Now what about a patient you presented to, say, four months ago, so it's not recent, and the patient just said they wanted to think about it? Maybe they're scheduled for a hygiene visit two months from now. I could do one of two things. One, do nothing and wait for them to show up in two months for hygiene. Or two, call those patients and schedule them to come back in for a brief consultation with the doctor, to make sure everything is staying stable. Basically, I'm attempting to get that patient back in and put them in front of the doctor again, so we have the opportunity to present that treatment plan.
This is very reflective of what I discussed about six episodes back. We found that some practices put a huge focus on new patients. You diagnose and present the whole thing, but say you presented that treatment plan to a new patient and they didn't accept it. Then they come in for their recall, and then the next recall, and nobody presents treatment again. Or you had a patient at recall, you presented a treatment plan, and they said no. When they come in for their next recall, nobody presents the treatment plan, as if we do it once and that's it, because they said no six months ago. That's a bad way of operating. Every time you encounter this patient there should be a discussion until the treatment is completed. You can do that in a way that isn't cheesy or pushy, because what is our objective? We're trying to improve this patient's health.
So as the treatment coordinator, we're either getting patients back on the hygiene schedule or, if they're not due for hygiene, getting them back for a quick look-see with the doctor to make sure everything is staying stable. Most likely, when you start working the incomplete treatment list, you'll have a ton of patients who are overdue and unscheduled. If I had a bunch who were unscheduled and a few who were scheduled and coming in over the next month or two, I'd focus on the unscheduled, because I'm going to be seeing the others for hygiene in the next one to two months.
On top of the outflow to the patient base, what else would my day consist of? Administration. I have contracts to handle. I have to fill out chart notes based on the financial arrangements and discussion with the patient. And I have to attend the various coordination meetings: the morning production meeting, the staff meeting, and so on.
Those are the nine basic things: lineups, meeting with patients, following up on recent presentations, outflow to the patient base by calling patients on the outstanding treatment list, getting them in for recall or, if they're not overdue, getting them in to see if things are stable, and then coordination meetings and administrative work. That's essentially the job. If I had a salesperson working in a service-based business, that would essentially be their job too, because that's what this job really is.
A couple of things to look out for. Say I'm the treatment coordinator and I'm spending all day in patient meetings, either doing financial arrangements or helping with consultations. I can barely do the follow-up I have to do on recent presentations, and I have zero time to follow up on the incomplete treatment list. That's a problem. Your business is missing an opportunity, and it means you don't have enough treatment coordinator time. This is where you have to get smart. Maybe you don't need another full-time treatment coordinator yet. Maybe you need a part-time one.
In a lot of practices, the treatment coordinator is initially the office manager, doing it in addition to their office manager duties. Eventually, after they've handed off other positions like financial coordinator and scheduler, the treatment coordinator job is the last position they turn over. Sales is a little more difficult. I hate to use that word, but maybe it's the right one. Closing is a little more difficult than scheduling. This isn't a dig at the schedulers out there at all, but it takes a bit more training to be effective at it. It's usually the last job the office manager turns over, also because it's directly linked to business income.
Say I'm the office manager and I find myself spending four or five hours a day sitting in on presentations. I probably need to hire a treatment coordinator, and I'm eventually going to have to apprentice this person until they can close. I'd do that as I'm doing my presentations. The rest of the day, I'd have this person working on follow-ups, or getting patients back on the hygiene schedule, because that creates more opportunities. So me being a part-time treatment coordinator while I apprentice a new, full-time treatment coordinator almost equates to about one and a half treatment coordinators. Once I put this person on the job, there may be times when two or three patients need treatment presented at the same time. We're both on deck, and we're both doing it together.
You want to look at this from a resources perspective as well as a time perspective. If your treatment coordinator does not have time to do follow-ups and call the incomplete treatment list, you're missing a large opportunity, and you do need more treatment coordinator hours. How you figure that out depends on your individual situation.
I mentioned I'd discuss, toward the end of the episode, how the treatment coordinator integrates into the practice, specifically on the closing side of things. Generally, the treatment coordinator works with the doctor. You ideally want the treatment coordinator there with the doctor while the treatment plan is being discussed, as I mentioned earlier. That's more important with a newer treatment coordinator than with a more experienced one.
For example, say I'm presenting a $4,000 case and I have a treatment coordinator who's dynamite. We've worked as a team for years and know exactly what the other is thinking half the time, and that treatment coordinator happens to be wrapping up another presentation right now. I could probably start this presentation myself, and then walk the patient over to the treatment coordinator when I'm done, assuming they're done with the patient they were with. I turn it over in front of the patient: "Here's Mr. Jones. He needs X, Y, Z." Then I leave the room. The treatment coordinator knows how I handle things and should be able to close. A more experienced one will be able to do that. A newer one may not. They're not really with it yet. That's a bit of a problem, so ideally you want them there with you.
As this develops, say you bring in an associate doctor who is diagnosing treatment, so you're not doing it all yourself. Or say you're out of the country for a month. If your treatment coordinator is a really good closer and the associate can explain the treatment and answer the patient's questions, even if they don't yet have the sales training to get into fees (which they should), they can pass the patient over to the treatment coordinator. Maybe you won't have as good a close rate as you would with the lead doctor, but you'll at least get something, which is really good.
The ideal situation is that the doctor and the treatment coordinator should both be able to close. And again, closing is only part of this. There are a lot of other actions, and they all have the same objective. Why am I lining up my week? Why am I making all these calls to follow up or get patients back on the schedule? It's to create more opportunities to close, and the object of those opportunities is to improve the patient's health. That's a good thing.
If you don't have a treatment coordinator and you're thinking about adding one, here's an interesting point. I was talking to Dan Brown, who you've heard on the podcast before, especially in the marketing episodes. He's a partner at Blumberg Digital and also a senior consultant here at MGE. There are a lot of positions we look at and think of as positions for larger practices, a luxury, or something along those lines. I agree that in certain cases, in a smaller practice, the office manager might be double-hatted as the office manager and the treatment coordinator. But for certain positions, what you don't seek can hurt you.
You may be missing a lot of new patient opportunities, for example. Say you're getting a bunch of phone calls and not converting them because your receptionist is so busy they don't have time to breathe, and they're putting patients on hold every five seconds because another person is walking up to the front desk. You might benefit from a new patient coordinator. Or you find that you have four or five thousand inactive charts sitting there and nobody is calling them. You might benefit from bringing somebody in to actually call those patients. The same applies to the treatment coordinator. You might have millions of dollars on your incomplete treatment list, or three or four treatment presentation opportunities a day that nobody has the time to do, in which case you might actually need a treatment coordinator.
If you are hiring a treatment coordinator, what are you looking for? Somebody who is smart, driven, a good communicator, and has no trouble discussing money and having people pay them. Some people view money as a huge taboo subject and feel uncomfortable discussing it. That's not a good idea. And since you as the doctor are also a salesperson, you should be comfortable doing that as well.
In the short run and the long run, I always recommend that the doctor and the treatment coordinator have some sales training. To that end, we have our MGE Communication and Sales Seminars, which are just dynamite. I'll put a link to them on the episode webpage where you can find out more. We can also give your treatment coordinator more orientation on our online training platform, DDS Success. We have a treatment coordinator training course there. If you want, you can get a free demo of the platform, and I'll put a link to it on the episode webpage. If you are a podcast listener, mention it to the person giving you the demo and they'll give you a special $20 a month discount. It's usually $289 a month, and we give it to you for $269.
That's about all I have on that. I know it ran on, but I wanted to give you an idea of what this job should look like, because we tend to focus on just the one aspect of the job, presenting treatment, and there is so much more. Trust me, if you have a treatment coordinator in your practice, you probably have more than enough to keep them completely busy. And if they really do their job well, a lot of cool things happen. You collect more money, you're more profitable, the practice expands, and most important of all, you end up with more healthy patients.
That's all I have for you this week. If you'd like to know more about MGE, you can find us online at mgeonline.com or call us at (800) 640-1140. I have those links on the episode webpage, which includes the links for DDS Success, the MGE Communication and Sales Seminars, and the morning production meeting, which I would definitely check out. The morning production meeting is a free download. Feel free to download it. It's useful. If you have questions, you can always email me at jeffb@mgeonline.com. Folks, I hope all this helps. Have a great week, and we'll see you next episode.